In Response To FR's Luircin

Source: FreeRepublic.com | April 2016 | plewis1250

Okay, here are the points that I’m using to try to come to my beliefs on the right candidate.

I’m also inviting Trumpinator to join in the conversation if he’d like to with his own points, or just hang back, since I was the one who kind of interrupted here.

I’ll number my points for ease of reference.

1. The issue that matters MOST in this election is border control. If we lose on this, the uniparty elites will import enough illegals to ensure that we never win an election again. Meaning that we lose on everything.

2. If I trust a candidate on this, then they have my support, even if it may be reluctant support, because it’s about the long-term survival of the nation, not to mention conservatism.

3. I trust Donald Trump on this matter. There are points on which I wish that he would be stronger, but even if he’s doing this as an ego trip, I can’t imagine why he’d risk becoming the most hated man in America by welshing on his promises. He’d lose money; he’d lose face; he’d hurt his children.

4. The party insiders on both sides want amnesty, which is a death knell for conservatism and this country. I want to get control OUT of their hands.

5. Cruz, even if I am going to assume that he’s absolutely sincere, is an unacceptable risk at this point. One, his numbers in the swing states are very, very bad. Two, the only way for him to get the nomination is to either sell his political soul to the party insiders in exchange for their support, OR to give them an unacceptable amount of influence over the nomination process. The party insiders want to destroy the nation and conservatism with amnesty. Unacceptable.

5b. Kaisch is unacceptable, period. He’s not even pretending to be conservative. Anyone the uniparty puts in is unacceptable.

6. Hillary would be disastrous. Trump isn’t perfect, but at the WORST he’s a wild card, when Hillary is a guaranteed disaster. To a lesser extent, Sanders too.

7. This leaves Trump as the only choice left, in my opinion.

8. Even if he comes out as 100 percent pro-transvestite… well, I won’t like it at all. But when the alternative is losing the entire country, then I’ll endure it while fighting against that aspect. This is not Romney v. Obama in which we could potentially make the argument that it didn’t make a difference which one got in.

Postscript.

Trump is from New York City. I’m not surprised at his more lefty positions on social matters. He’s more right-wing than most NYC liberals; I know because I’ve lived there and met them. His comments, to me, are the comments of someone who grew up with liberal insanity and was taught that it was normal for most of his life, and he never really thought about it until recently. He’s beginning to realize how stupid so much of NYC liberalism is, but an overnight jump from one to the other is very very rare.

I became a conservative because of national security. It took me a while to embrace social conservatism. I had to think about it, and I had to take steps.

I’m willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Especially when the alternative is Hillary.

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  • Discussion
  • plewis #4942

    After spending an hour and a half typing my response, I was unable to post it due to getting the zot ax tonight. *sigh* After 13 years plewis1250 is no more…

    Here was my response. Luircin, if you ever find a chance to read it, know that someone attempted to have a civil discourse with you, but the powers that be on FR did not allow for it.

    Sorry for the delay, I wanted to take the time to respond in thought out responses and not quick drive by snips.

    1: “The issue that matters MOST in this election is border control. If we lose on this, the uniparty elites will import enough illegals to ensure that we never win an election again. Meaning that we lose on everything.”

    I definitely agree the border is a MAJOR issue. It’s a gaping hole which has drastic negative effects on our security, economy, and our identity as a free people. 100% agree with ya it is a crucial, if not the defining issue of the election. I’m with ya there.

    2: “If I trust a candidate on this, then they have my support, even if it may be reluctant support, because it’s about the long-term survival of the nation, not to mention conservatism.”

    Still with ya, though I view conservatism as the vehicle in which said policy change can happen, not as an addendum to the overall policy structure. In my view, conservatism enables and is the driving force behind securing our border.

    3: “I trust Donald Trump on this matter. There are points on which I wish that he would be stronger, but even if he’s doing this as an ego trip, I can’t imagine why he’d risk becoming the most hated man in America by welshing on his promises. He’d lose money; he’d lose face; he’d hurt his children.”

    Here is where you and I split ways. I do not trust Donald J. Trump. He is a man of poor character, and even poorer reputation. He has an extensive record of lying, cheating, and being cruel. His record is one which we actually have a LOT of information on given his VERY high profile lifestyle he has led for the better part of 3 decades. From swindling business partners through failed bankruptcies, to numerous failed marriages, some of which are directly attributed to the man’s infidelity, to bragging about conquering married women as if they were prizes that only he could achieve, this speaks volumes at who this man is and what he values: himself. He is a man of very little character. I am unable to trust him, and unfortunately for him, he is in a position of needing my trust. He is approaching me from the left. He approaches with decades of supporting liberal policies and palling around with liberal and GOP elites. I need to trust him in order to support that his sudden conversion to conservatism is real. And make no mistake, it is sudden. He is 69 years old. In 2009/2010 he started coming on the radar of conservatives as a potential political leader. So at best he has been a conservative for 7 years. Maybe he truly had a life changing experience. it’s very possible. But it appears to me to be political opportunism more than genuine conservative principles and ideals. There are numerous accounts (true or not, there is no way to know for sure) of him being a vindictive person. I honestly feel he was pissed Obama beat his good friend Hillary Clinton in 2008. He saw a political opening given the WEAK candidates the GOP was nominating, and seized the opportunity. Remember, he is a calculating businessman. He is not foolish from this standpoint. You do not have the success he does being foolish. I honestly feel he made a calculated decision to avenge Clinton. Hence, he started his standard tactic of attacking an opponent on something very personal and difficult to answer, Obama’s birth certificate. This was gasoline for the trampled, battered, and beaten conservatives looking for SOMEONE to go after Obama, given the gutless leadership in the GOPe. He saw the reaction, and saw what could be turned into political advantage: move right. The problem is, he lives in New York and the elite circles of Palm Beach. These are not people like you and I. They work in NY during the week and go to their beach homes on the weekend, primarily during the cooler months; otherwise they are in the Hamptons. He IS the elite. It is the circles he travels in. Given I believe his “conversion” is showmanship; the vail will have to be lowered, in his mind, to get elected. So, given all of that, the trust, even on a crucial issue like the border, I do not believe he will uphold. If he really IS a Trojan horse, what would get him more fame and more notoriety than pulling one over on the GOP? Sure we would be pissed at him, but what does he care? Assuming he is a liberal really, to him we are backwoods hicks clinging to our guns, religion, and bigotry ways. Like I said, I have no trust in what this man says or does.

    4: “The party insiders on both sides want amnesty, which is a death knell for conservatism and this country. I want to get control OUT of their hands.”

    This is definitely the case. Both sides have their skids greased with the money of the amnesty lobby. Thank goodness conservatism exists, otherwise it would already be in place.

    5: “Cruz, even if I am going to assume that he’s absolutely sincere, is an unacceptable risk at this point. One, his numbers in the swing states are very, very bad. Two, the only way for him to get the nomination is to either sell his political soul to the party insiders in exchange for their support, OR to give them an unacceptable amount of influence over the nomination process. The party insiders want to destroy the nation and conservatism with amnesty. Unacceptable.”

    Once again, we part ways.
    From all indications, Cruz is extremely sincere in what he is saying. He is not approaching from a position of 30+ years of liberal thought and beliefs, but rather from a position of 15+ years of defending conservatism and our rights. He is extremely faithful in his faith with God, and exudes that sincerity. What he says, I know he means. I can take it to the bank. He has not done a single thing which makes me question his sincerity. Not a single one.
    In regards to his numbers in the swing states, if Cruz’s ability on that standpoint is bad, Trump’s is much much worse.
    Ohio:
    Cruz vs Clinton: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/oh/ohio_cruz_vs_clinton-4245.html
    Trump vs Clinton:
    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/oh/ohio_trump_vs_clinton-5634.html

    Florida:
    Cruz vs Clinton:
    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/fl/florida_cruz_vs_clinton-4214.html

    Trump vs Clinton:
    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/fl/florida_trump_vs_clinton-5635.html

    Even non-swing states:

    Mississippi:
    Cruz vs Clinton:
    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/ms/mississippi_cruz_vs_clinton-4208.html

    Trump vs Clinton:
    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/ms/mississippi_trump_vs_clinton-5857.html

    Texas: (old data, so not the best example)
    Cruz vs Clinton:
    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/tx/texas_cruz_vs_clinton-3982.html

    Trump vs Clinton:
    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/tx/texas_trump_vs_clinton-5694.html

    Utah:
    Cruz vs Clinton:
    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/ut/utah_cruz_vs_clinton-5836.html

    Trump vs Clinton:
    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/ut/utah_trump_vs_clinton-5834.html

    If Texas is lost, or even a state as conservative as Utah is lost, we lose in the general. Clinton will be a formidable foe, no doubt. It will be a very close election even if we have a rock solid candidate. If we have a weak one whom has no consistency in what they believe, and more importantly cannot articulate the conservative message, we get slaughtered. We are talking a Reagan vs. Mondale level of slaughter. When states like Utah are in play, something is seriously wrong.

    As to the coalition of support via the delegates, I would 100% agree if he was the one pandering to the GOPe. As far as I can tell, he is not. He has not changed a single position since they sidled up alongside Senator Cruz. He has remained consistent. They came to him, he did not go to them. He is not promulgating amnesty. In fact, the one (outside of Kasich whom is scum) who has been pushing amnesty, is actually Trump. He even espoused that today:

    “They’re going to go and we’re going to create a path where we can get them into this country legally. — They’re going to come back, and They’re going to come back legally.” (http://www.today.com/video/trump-on-today-town-hall-abortion-exceptions-immigration-raising-taxes-more-670689347771)

    That’s called touchback amnesty. it’s a liberal dream: quicky vacation for these folks, paid for by the government, and at the end of the day, millions of new RAT voters forever thankful of the liberals whom gave them such a gift.

    The elites want this. It secures their power for the foreseeable future. Trump is one of them. He is not an outsider, he was just on the paying side of the pay to play game. Trump actively participates in H1 visas for hiring inexpensive labor, flying them in, and using them at his resorts and various other portions of his companies. He is the amnesty candidate, not Cruz.

    5b: “Kaisch is unacceptable, period. he’s not even pretending to be conservative. Anyone the uniparty puts in is unacceptable.”

    100% agree. Kasich is a joke. Moron might be the better term. He is a liberal hack no better than Mitch McConnell or his fellow Ohioan Mr. Boehner.

    6: “Hillary would be disastrous. Trump isn’t perfect, but at the WORST he’s a wild card, when Hillary is a guaranteed disaster. To a lesser extent, Sanders too.”

    Hillary would be disastrous. Never could vote for her. The damage she could accomplish to the Supreme Court alone scares the heck out of me. Another 4 years of the same old crap, we are thru. Sander’s is just a lunatic. Fortunately, his policy ideas would never go anywhere outside of the discussion in the line at the local medical marijuana dispensary.

    My problem with the wild card argument is what I just wrote about. I lack trust in him. I cannot trust him at all actually. Combine that with the fact that he cannot win (according to the current polling which can vary greatly by election day) and there is just no way I could get behind him. Obviously if there is no other choice, what can you do? But we did that same game with Romney and McCain. Why do it again? When we HAVE a conservative?? We have someone whom is likely to the right of Reagan, the last conservative whom ran, and what happened when that conservative did run? We had a resounding victory. Then, 4 years later, 3000 votes short of a perfect victory. Conservatism can and does win elections. Why risk Trump being a flop, or even worse, the liar I believe him to be? The risk is just not worth it.

    7: “This leaves Trump as the only choice left, in my opinion.”

    This leaves Cruz as the only choice left, in my opinion.

    8: Even if he comes out as 100% pro-transvestite… well, I won’t like it at all. But when the alternative is losing the entire country, then I’ll endure it while fighting against that aspect. This is not Romney v. Obama in which we could potentially make the argument that it didn’t make a difference which one got in.

    I agree, but disagree on this point. You are right, it’s not Romney v. Obama, but it actually could be much worse. It could be, in a worst case scenario, a set of decades long friends, whom even attend the weddings and social gatherings of the other, standing on stage, “debating” before the entire world to see. At least Romney v. Obama feigned adversary, and on paper attested as such. Trump has actively given and supported the person he likely would be debating in the general. The ads practically write themselves, and That’s assuming he is being honest about who he is.
    “Donald J. Trump liked Hillary Clinton so much, he gave several hundred thousand dollars to her? he even supported her 2008 Presidential run. If Trump likes her, shouldn’t you?”

    It will be a crushing defeat. Even worse, his negatives are the highest of any GOP candidate, ever. On average he is hovering right around 70%. Think about that. 7/10 people have a negative impression of him. When you get into specific demographic categories, it gets even higher. The consequences will not be a lost Presidency. With that, we are likely doomed for a few decades. Instead, there are some polls and studies which show the loss will be up and down the ticket. The Senate of course would clearly be in play, and potentially even the House. We’re talking about total defeat in one evening.

    The risk is too great with someone like Donald J. Trump.

    “Postscript:

    Trump is from New York City. I’m not surprised at his more lefty positions on social matters. he’s more right-wing than most NYC liberals; I know because I’ve lived there and met them. His comments, to me, are the comments of someone who grew up with liberal insanity and was taught that it was normal for most of his life, and he never really thought about it until recently. he’s beginning to realize how stupid so much of NYC liberalism is, but an overnight jump from one to the other is very very rare.”

    His stances on social conservatism are ones which are wildly inconsistent. I understand he grew up in a place which is in stark comparison with Texas or the south; however the problem with his positions is his pandering. On abortion alone he jumped all over the map over an 18 hour period, unable to determine which way he should land. It was political positioning. Okay fine. it’s what politicians do. it’s also what liars do. It speaks to the man’s character, or lack of it, and destroys his credibility. If I cannot trust him on something like abortion, or as basic as if a transgender person should use the restroom of the opposite sex, what on earth CAN I trust him on”

    The answer of course, is nothing.

    One cannot honestly trust Donald J. Trump on anything. He offers no reason to.

    That is why we must find an alternative to him. Fortunately, we have one standing at the ready. We have someone whom has fought over and over for our constitutional rights, for our liberty. We have someone whom has a track record of defending the second amendment and the religious freedoms the constitution affords us. We have someone whom was ostracized by just almost every member of the Senate, including his own party, for standing firm on what he promised to do, defund Obamacare. We have a man of principle and conviction, whom has given no reason (aside from libelous trash coming from the National Enquirer) to not trust he is who he says he is. He is hated universally in Washington because he sticks by his beliefs. That is EXACTLY who we need to be leading the helm during these tumultuous times.

    We need President Ted Cruz.

    • This topic was modified 5 years, 7 months ago by plewis.
    Myself6 #4946

    Count me out of the Trump support. and if he is the GOP nominee out of the convention… you can count me out of the GOP.

    coolrain #4952

    It’s thoughtful posts like that, that attracted me to FR several years ago. Unfortunately these days, it’s like throwing pearls at swine. I PM’d JR this morning to please delete my account. I don’t want my name to be associated with sites like that any longer.

    plewis #4957

    Oh I am definitely #NeverTrump #OnlyCruz.

    I was walking a thin line surrounding “supporting the nominee” per the edict over at FR.

    I was hoping it would be a nonissue once Cruz won the nomination, but I was zotted last night (13 years…. gone.) for “trolling”…

    kik5150 #4967

    Say anything negative about Trump on FR and you will be banned. It should be called “Jim Robinson’s Trump Republic”.

    • This reply was modified 5 years, 7 months ago by kik5150.
    rgintn #4991

    Trump is Hillary with more money.
    #nevertrump

    Since I’ve been suspended from posting at FR for months for supporting Cruz I’ll post it here:)

    silver pines #4992

    JimRob is posting threads about Cruz being a loser and a traitor, etc. It is all I can do not to go over there and tell that stupid, moronic, Trumpsucking POS exactly what I think of him. The only reason I don’t is because I refuse to give the harpies and the fools a source of entertainment when I get zotted. But I want to do it SO much.

    I’ll catch up on posts later, but in the meantime, the gopbriefingroom has a list of people they’re going to Freepmail and invite to their site. I’ve invited a bunch of people from the last zotfest….I’m going to post their list here in case anyone wants to offer an invitation before they have a chance to go elsewhere.

    House Atreides
    Seaplane
    Texas Yellow Rose
    JediJones
    cornfedcowboy

    okie01
    babyfreep
    DrewsDad
    uglybiker
    BeadCounter
    Impy
    daifu
    Boowhoknew
    IAMNO1

    drop 50 and fire for effect
    TheCornerOffice
    beaware

    Presbyterian Reporter
    Gil4
    reviled downesdad
    Hurricane Andrew
    TurkeyLurkey
    fieldmarshaldj
    JustAmy
    Idaho_Cowboy
    Drago
    PLMerite
    mdg211

    rodamala #4999

    I do not have access to the email send function… A majority of those zotted probably can read their FRemail, but can’t respond. Someone with access please send thosr people instructions links and executive admin email addresses so we can increase volume here.

    silver pines #5009

    I do not have access to the email send function… A majority of those zotted probably can read their FRemail, but can’t respond. Someone with access please send thosr people instructions links and executive admin email addresses so we can increase volume here.

    On it.

    Victoria #5012

    Plewis, you wrote a great article and it’s obvious it took you a long time to do it. I’m sorry it didn’t get on FR, but I suppose it would be treated as treason on there.

    • This reply was modified 5 years, 7 months ago by Victoria.
    slhancock1948 #5020

    Great piece you wrote there, Plewis! A keeper for anyone who is wondering which way to go. That guy’s contention that border security is #1 is a false flag for Trump. It’s a campaign pledge he’s already reneged on months back, saying that the illegals have made him reconsider.

    But the most important thing to me is this. Can we not trust God to work through Cruz to do the things our country needs if we actually put our trust in God and then voted for the godly man? We’re actually saying that we don’t need God to work for us, that we can solve our own problems. Cruz knows this is impossible. Trump is saying HE can do it, just put our trust in him. WRONG choice! That will lead to disaster, but even more, like has been stated, Trump doesn’t want this, he is running for Hillary to win.

    Pray for righteousness to be restored and for the peace of Jerusalem

    mostlyhomebound #5021

    Sen. Cruz said now is a time for choosing. Indeed, it is. But it is only secondarily a political choice. It is a choice between life and death. We must decide whom we will serve. stump is the wrong choice. I know Whom Sen. Cruz serves.

    plewis #5022

    Thank you for the compliments.

    I really was trying to respond with gentleness and logical points.

    There is a clear point in their thinking at which we split ways, but it was the first time a Trump person had reached out to me in a civil manor.

    They probably think I chickened out.

    Oh well.

    rgintn #5025

    @ Silver Pines, How in the world is Cruz a traitor! That is delusional thinking.

    Does JR support tax increases now becuase trump supports it???? Now thats being a traitor to Conservatism

    Woodcutter #5141

    Plewis, Thank you for a well-written and thoughtful point by point discussion. I never could understand why people would support DT; your post makes it very clear why Ted Cruz is our best choice!

    silver pines #5244

    @ Silver Pines, How in the world is Cruz a traitor! That is delusional thinking.

    Does JR support tax increases now becuase trump supports it???? Now thats being a traitor to Conservatism

    I think you nailed it—delusional thinking. Jim also said that Cruz is no conservative. I believe it’s a spiritual delusion that’s been visited on some people.

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